According to the results of a new Field Poll on California voters’ support for gay marriage published yesterday, Asian Americans are the group most opposed to same-sex unions in the state. Previous polls have shown similar results so this isn’t anything new, but the difference in this study is that it’s broken down further into specific subsets and the Asian ethnic group that is most opposed to same-sex marriage by far are…Korean Americans:
The new Field Poll reveals that Korean Americans disapprove of same-sex marriage by a margin of 70 to 25 percent. They were followed in their dislike of same-sex couples by Vietnamese Americans (64 percent disapproval) and Chinese Americans (54 percent disapprove.)
African Americans disapprove of gay marriage by a margin of 49 to 38 percent, the poll finds, while Latinos support same-sex marriage by a margin of 50 to 41. About 53 percent of whites support same-sex marriage, with 39 percent opposed.
So why are my fellow country people so opposed to this issue?
I’m sure it could have something to do with the fact that Christianity is probably more prevalent in the Korean community than in the other Asian groups. Not only that, but I can’t think of another country, with the possible exception of the United States, whose people have more readily embraced a conservative, tea party brand of Christianity than Koreans have and that certainly also translates to Koreans here in America.
And no matter what same-sex marriage opponents may say about how their agenda is about defending the sanctity of marriage and not about being anti-gay, let’s be honest—it is about being anti-gay.
Why would someone have an issue with gays getting married if they didn’t have an issue with gays? And I don’t buy the “Bible says marriage is solely between a man and a woman” excuse because if you were seriously devoted to doing everything the Bible tells you to do, you’d be eating crickets, not wearing clothes with mixed wool/linen fibers, sacrificing oxen and killing magicians (yeah, look it up, it’s all there).
Bye-bye, Doug Henning!
But when it comes to Koreans and gays, it’s especially a shame because the two groups have so much in common. For example, I don’t know anyone who loves to party and get wasted more than Koreans and gays. So one group prefers to party in Koreatown and the other in West Hollywood. So one group prefers soju and Hite and the other frilly mixed drinks with umbrellas in them. So one group prefers going out in slutty outfits with enough make-up to prompt a circus clown to be like, “Damn, what’s all the shit on your face?!” and the other group…well, see, so much in common.
And if you want to talk about drama, are there any two groups who are more dramatic than Koreans and gays? Have you checked out the programs on Logo TV? They’re like the English-language drag versions of Korean soap operas. Just substitute the “my lover is dying of cancer” subplot with “my lover is dying of AIDS” and you can’t tell the difference. And if you can find anyone who’s better at gossiping and talking shit behind people’s back than Koreans and gays, you let me know. And who can fight with more passion over the most trivial things than Koreans and gays? A simple disagreement about what to have for dinner could lead to a major blow-up ending in either domestic violence (if you’re Korean) or one person fucking the other person’s best friend to get back at them (if you’re gay).
Finally, when I think to myself…who are the most materialistic and superficial people I’ve ever met? Once again, I immediately think of Korean and gays. The only people I know who work at shitty minimum wage jobs, yet somehow manage to afford the latest designer clothes, get their seasonal plastic surgery, drive the sleekest new cars and go to all the hotspots looking absolutely fabulous are Koreans and gays. They don’t care if they’re millions of dollars in debt because they know it’s better to look good than to feel good.
So I ask my fellow Koreans to look at our gay brethren and see all the commonalities we share. We should be supporting them in their cause, not opposing them. OK, maybe you don’t approve of the idea of a man sticking his penis in another man’s mouth. But hey, need I remind you that we put shit like this in our mouths:
And that’s pretty damn nasty too.
anyone know how these numbers compare to mormons? just curious…not being accusatory….
What a lot of people don’t think about with regard to the politics of immigrant communities is that generally speaking, immigrants are both socially and fiscally conservative, coming as they do from places less liberal than the West. I of course can’t speak for every group, but this certainly applies to all East Asians, with Koreans being a particularly interesting example, what with their absorption of evangelical Christianity (Going to Iraq and Afghanistan to preach the Word? Really?)
When they immigrate, however, they find themselves in the minority: visibly, culturally, economically, socially, and liberals are generally a lot friendlier to minorities than conservatives. So immigrants end up “becoming” liberalized and supporting liberal factions and causes, because it’s in their self-interest to do so.
What will be interesting to watch in the next decade or so is whether there will be a political shift among immigrants: since basic rights and notions of equality and fairness are becoming strongly entrenched in the law and the culture, will their “intrinsic” conservatism come to the fore again? There are plenty of Asian immigrants out there who dislike/fear/resent gays, blacks, Aboriginals, and the multi-generational poor: if they feel their rights will not be threatened by conservatives, then what else will differentiate them from those conservatives?
It’s bad enough that Asian Americans so vehemently oppose gay rights, but think of all the internal homophobia gay Asian Americans must experience as a result of living in such conservative and intolerant religious communities.
Just think how much larger the vote margin on Prop. 8 would’ve been if Asian/Korean-Americans actually voted in proportional numbers. Almost enough to make you rethink encouraging increased Asian-American turnout.
Stealth M.C., it’s funny ’cause I would argue the opposite in many ways.
For instance, many immigrants come and having grown up in a different environment, naturally fear the new environment and become more conservative financially and politically (let’s not cause a fuss or they may take my stuff away!). And also, as new immigrants, they are less aware of the tradition in this country of the civil rights movement and equality, etc., so they do not understand the ground that liberals often stand upon.
However, I think your assessment of the SECOND generation is correct, that the kids of immigrants are now in the minority and they are also getting educated on civil rights and are less fearful and more embracing of what American freedom means. They skew more liberal methinks.
Very strange! In 2008, Asian Americans were actually the most opposed to Prop 8:
http://www.advocate.com/article.aspx?id=41428
What happened in the interim?
in 2008, a lot of the first generation asian-ams were unaware of Prop 8 – most likely because it didn’t directly affect them. at least to their knowledge. (while the ones who were aware at the start of the whole Prop 8 fiasco were against it. for the most part, passionately so.) since then, there have been major marketing blasts and campaigns for prop h8. –permeating deeply into the religious sectors (i.e. korean-american christians), etc. which is why you have a bunch of voters coming out from the woodwork voting against gay marriage. campaigning works! “save marriage!” “save your family!”
oh yeah, i did a play about Prop 8 a few months ago which was centered around this campaign: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mog3JVbbHDU
good stuff!
(it’s not korean, it’s chinese. but close enough.)
Put ‘em all in camp. In 20 years there’ll be a rebellion, angry plays produced.
After that, it’s all Lakers and the ‘burbs.
This is not that surprisingly is it? Korean Americans are overwhelmingly Republican and conservative evangelical Christians (the Tea Party/Sarah Palin kind) so I actually think the poll underestimated Korean AM’s opposition to gay marriage. It’s probably more like 9-1 against.
The rest of the stats also jive with my hypothesis that the rate of each group’s opposition to gay marriage is probably also about the same as each group’s GOP affiliation/registration. Vietnamese American (also strongly Republican) is 2/3 against gay marriage. No surprises there. Chinese American (roughly 50/50 split) is just slightly over 1/2 against gay marriage. The news article didn’t mention the rest of the APAC groups but I’m sure there is majority support for gay marriage from Japanese American and Hawaiians (strongly Democratic).
This goes to prove another one of my long running theory that Asian Americans are not a monolithic voting blocks and their votes often cancel each other out. You have Korean, Filipino and Vietnamese Americans to the right (sometimes the FAR right); Japanese, Thai, Hmong, Taiwanese Americans, and Hawaiians to the left; and Chinese Americans split right down the middle.
Philip,
you speak for yourself and your brain washed leftist ilk.
You state that Christianity and right-wing homophobia is an import into those respective ethnic countries, which I will not argue.
What I will argue is that prior to Christiandoms’ spread and popularity, homo-sexuality was already a taboo.
In all of East Asia’s religions and philosophies, will you find ANY promotion of such activities.
Buddhism, Shinto, Taoism, etc; are all devoid of homo-sexuality. Do you ever wonder why? Are Asians in the far east wrong about their belief systems?
What about Judaism, Hinduism, Islam, and others?
The leftist gay agenda (for me) has no place in my life.
I don’t need religion to tell me the pitfalls of the gay lifestyle. Empirical evidence, statistical data, and everyday interaction gives me all the info I need to make a sound judgement on ANY said behaviors or beliefs.
I would hope that as Asian Americans, myself being second generation, that we do not blindly fall into shallow political alliances based on cultural propaganda that is force fed to ALL Americans on a consistent basis.
Thank you, and please think INDEPENDENTLY.
Hey Aaron,
I’m always interested to hear about the opinion of the second gen asian-americans right-wingers. I consider I’m an independent myself, though I voted for Obama (okay I voted for my candidate, but Obama was really the reason why I voted for him), I’m happy to say that I’m very critical of some of the adminstration’s decision making in the past year.
And I’ll be happy to vote for the right if their policies matches my ideologies, but there’s a few blockades that’s stopping me from doing so.
For example, a few years back, Michelle Malkin published what I consider as a very poorly researched and offensive book that justified the internment of Japanese-Americans in the second world war. And reading the book reviews on Amazon, it was quite obvious that the ones that praised and loved the book were right-wingers.
So my question is that “would that be a view shared by the majority of right-wingers?” (if so, then I really can’t convince myself to vote for the right) and if not, is there any action taken or done to condemn these views? Because right now, the only prominant Asian republicans that’s prominant seems to be on the extreme sides like Barry Wong and Malkin.
@Aaron, thanks for sharing your thoughts. Always welcome differing opinions here. But do want to point out that historically at least in the east Asian cultures and religions, homosexuality was NOT considered taboo and in many cases was considered normal. I can cite many examples but will just mention a few here:
In the traditional Japanese samurai class, there was a long and valued tradition of an older warrior mentoring a younger apprentice and this included a sexual relationship between the two referred to as either “bi-do” (the beautiful way) or “wakashudo” (the way of the youth).
Most of the major eastern religions did not frown on homosexuality. The only issue with it was if it interfered with the siring of children which was considered important. But beyond that, all’s open. For ex, Confucianism has no issue with a man taking other male lovers on the side as long as he fulfills his duty to sire children.
Taoism is even more liberal on this issue–because it is rooted in the balance of male and female, the yin and the yang, the philosophy recognizes that a man (and it’s almost always a man in these examples) may have more of the female in him and this was seen as a natural thing. There are a number of Taoist gods and goddesses who “reside” with other gods of the same sex and the great philosopher Zhuangzi emphasized emphasized freedom and that those things we considered “out of the ordinary” (like homosexuality) were in fact “ordinary” in the natural order of things.
Finally, I visited Thailand a few years ago and was surprised at how much the culture accepted gays and “ladyboys.” Touring the Buddhist monasteries across that nation provided me with the answer–the country is overwhelmingly Buddhist and the Buddhists are accepting of everyone.
Yes, you can find anti-gay sentiment in the history of these cultures but you also can’t ignore that homosexuality was also an integral and positive aspect of these very cultures as well.
Hello N,
Thank you for your response and questions. I will do my best to share my thoughts on your topics.
First, I will clarify, that some of my views may be construed as right-wing- would’nt you be suprised to know I have been a life-long Democrat!
Do not fall into the trap of typecasting individuals based on a few comments. We both know where stereotyping leads to….
I have NEVER strictly voted the party line during elections. You voted for One Bad Ass Mistake America, and I took the risk with McPain.
I consider myself an extreme centrist. Oxy-moron enough for ya? In other words, flexible, unfettered PRAGMATISM. Would this make me an atheist, or theist? Neither. I am happily a practical deist.
My disdain for partisan politics has always left me with plenty of bile and venom for BOTH sides of the political spectrum.
As far as knowing the pulse of right-wingers, I will simply say that I vote the the way I would rule.
N, Malkins’ book is a pre-text for the possible future with American muslims. Her tactics of persuasion are pure partisan jingoism and cheerleading.
Internment camps for muslims? Can it be done? Sure.
Would it be practical? No.
A more sensible approach is to stop immigration from such countries. What about the past injustice of the Chinese Exclusion Act? Is it not hypocritical for me to deny others their PRIVILEGE to enter the U.S.?
No. Not at all. To my knowledge, the Chinese never wanted to establish and propagate their religion on U.S. soil- to such an extent, that en masse, they could later demand Sharia laws be made available for them, and possibly the rest of us. Denial of their demands could be met with guaranteed acts of violence.
Presently the U.S. has a small percentage of muslims.
Has anyone kept track of acts of terrorism that have been committed or thwarted domestically by the ‘religion of peace’? I keep a loose tally. For one case of a Christian loon ‘spazzing’ out in dramatic fashion in a two to five year time frame, Muslims have between five and fifteen acts/thwarted plans a year!
And, they represent a small percentage of muslims in our country! Can you imagine if the muslims had a higher double digit population?!
Just look to the U.K., France, The Netherlands, Denmark, Malysia, and Indonesia for few examples of what the ‘religion of peace’ can bring to a nation.
I hope this answers some of your queries.
Vote for candidates that would best reflect the way you would protect and govern your family and community.
One last item for thought-
Is’nt it odd that many of us as Asian Americans have sided with political interests that weaken us?
Case in point: 2nd Amendment.
Our (some of us) past heritages have been one of tyranny by the ruling classes that would prohibit sword ownership (Japan), and Martial knowledge (China) to the masses.
Disarming of the law abiding citizen allows for tyranny.
Tyranny from the ruling class and the common street vermin.
Our country (the U.S) faces these obstacles.
Gun control does’nt work! Criminal control does!
Do not allow yourselves to be disarmed again!
Thank you once again, and take care.
[...] KOREAN AMERICANS HATE GAY MARRIAGE MORE THAN ANYONE ELSE: [...]
@Philip,
Thank you for your response. I appreciate the discourse.
You make some points- unfortunately, you seem to confuse the cultural leanings of a segment of the population to the general population and the religious/philososophical teachings which surrounded them.
Nowhere in any of these religious or philisophical texts, is the ADVOCACY of homosexuality. I understand there is no condemnation as well. Omission of doctrine does not make allowances for the justification of said behaviors.
You make mention of the samurai class and it’s leanings-
I am sure N.A.M.B.L.A. is eager to show this to justify their existence.
The gay lobby is stunningly silent when it comes to the issues of pedophilia, bestiality, urophilia, and a whole host of other behaviors I am sure they would find acceptable.
You make mention of Buddhists in Thailand.
Acceptance and tolerance DOES NOT mean advocacy.
The same can be said of failed pedophile priests in the Catholic church. The tolerance of these behaviors is political, and not an endorsement.
I may be accepting that my next door neighbor is gay- but I will not promote this behavior as rational, in a scientifically emperical sense to anyone.
By the way, Philip, did you know certain segments in continent of Africa find sex with infants acceptable for sexual gratification and the cure for AIDS?
I’m serious. Look it up.
Thanks again.
@Aaron
“The gay lobby is stunningly silent when it comes to the issues of pedophilia, bestiality, urophilia, and a whole host of other behaviors I am sure they would find acceptable.”
WTF?? How is it that seemingly rational people can reach such ludicrous conclusions?? Why on earth do you believe that the gay lobby would find pedophilia or bestiality acceptable?
I’ll tell you right now why they’re silent on such issues–because they have absolutely nothing to do with being gay, lesbian or transsexual! Believe it.
Sex or marriage between two consenting adults is in no way shape or form similar to sex between an adult and a child or between a person and an animal. While the former requires the participation of consenting adults, in the latter situations, children who have yet to reach the age of consent and animals cannot consent. I know, it’s hard for a homophobe to believe that someone (a gay person) would actually consent to being in a sexual relationship with someone of the same sex, but there is actually consent involved.
@Alex,
I’ll tell you why the the gay lobby will not dare condemn those other acts- it’s simple.
Philip used the history of the samurai’s homosexual man-boy relations as justification for the gay lobby and lifestyle, therefore advocating pedophilia- or did’nt you read his response to me?
You would be called out as an hypocrite condemning other people’s ‘choices’ when there are others abhorent of your choices.
Do you approve of N.A.M.B.L.A? Does the gay lobby openly condone the beliefs of this group?
Your lame argument of ‘consent’ bores me.
Let me enlighten you about consent…
There was a curious news story in Germany about a man who advertised the need for a willing ‘subject’.
Of course there was a response to this ad.
The two men met at his apartment and discussed the terms and agreed.
Well, as the story was reported, the apartment dweller was arrested for murder. He was found guilty. In his testimony, he revealed that his ‘partner’ willingly allowed him to methodically cannibalise the other. The ad openly made this clear.
So, according to your logic and rationale, he should have never have been arrested. After all, if more adults fancied the idea of consensual cannibalism, it would be within their rights? Correct? This is not abnormal behavior right?
Really, who are we to judge what is normal and rational, right? After all, these were two ‘consenting’ grown male adults, right?
I am sooooo sure there is no disconnect for you…
As a matter of fact, I am also sure there are incestuous, ‘farm’ loving so called conservatives just eager to advocate for the gay lobby, and finally ‘come’ out of the closet.
Alex, let me know when the vast majority of the animal
kingdom (which we are part) goes gay.
At that point I may have a change of heart.
Until then…Ciao baby! Oh, excuse me, wrong site- Chow bebe!
…wow.
kudos to you, alex, on staying silent after aaron’s last insane rant. don’t fuel that fire. some people just revel in having a platform to spew their nonsense.
@Jack,
Thank you for affirming my stances. Thank you for NOT addressing my questions raised.
Leftists like yourself consider my rants insane and nonsensical.
Meanwhile, your stalwart defense and issue raising for the gay lobby supersedes the actual physical toll on the Asian population in the U.S..
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article/article?f=/c/a/2010/05/01/BAT01D7H71.DTL
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/04/24/BA7D1D42N4.DTL
http://news.newamericamedia.org/news/view_article.html?article_id=f8da10a1067db0fe9414314849fbde18
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_type=videos&search_query=philadelphia+asian+students+attacked&search_sort=video_date_uploaded&suggested_categories=25&uni=3
In NYC alone, there has been countless attacks on Asian deliverymen, high school and university (remember Minghu Yu)(http://www.nydailynews.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=16569&start=40&tstart=0 ) students, and working professionals(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hjHYxAg-Sw). Some resulting in death.
There is more, but, individuals like yourself consider the small gay minority more important than these larger issues.
I don’t care what Asian ethnicity you may be part of, Jack, but there are bigger problems than gay rights!
Speaking of (the original topic of this blog) Koreans….http://www.insidebayarea.com/top-stories/ci_15607100
Jack, do you ever wonder why the Democrat party makes it difficult for law abiding minorities to protect themselves via the second Amendment? Much less ALL Americans?
Stop being and promoting the “weak men of Asia”!
Oh yeah Jack, let me know when there is a homosexual equivalent of the Guardian Angels making our streets safer for everyone!
Till then, Chao bebe!
Wow, indeed.
@ Jack: I think Alex was stunned into silence, and didn’t quite know what to say -.-;;
Aaron does seem rather “ranty,” but not insane (he is entitled to his opinion, after all, and I do sense intelligence beneath all that tirade). But he might want to tone down on the anger and hatred.
Aaron brought up a great point about minorities needing to protect themselves; however it should be achieved through the advocacy of human rights, civil rights, and continued education of minority issues. The right to bear arms should not apply to every individual equally without placing careful consideration in the potential consequences (people with schizophrenia for example, or individuals with histories of gang related violence or hate based crime). Liberals (more likely to live in cities) understand that guns are dangerous (I live in a major city, witnessed a shooting into a crowded boulevard, and had a man killed through gang related violence less than a block from my family’s home). Can anyone remember Virginia Tech, and Cho Seung-Hui? Like I said, schizophrenia (the crazy, violent Korean American didn’t really do a lot for Aaron’s argument at all).
As for gay marriage, it’s a civil rights issue. There was a time not too long ago when Asians and other minorities were legally prevented from marrying Whites as this was thought to be detrimental to the fabric of society. As a mixed race person of Japanese American descent who identifies as gay, I will defend my civil rights to the death (as I will do for people like Aaron, whether he likes it or not). Equal protection under the law MUST ALSO INCLUDE equal protection of financial rights, health rights, and the issues surrounding probate law.
And Aaron, the Asian American population makes up 4.4% of the total US population, mixed race 2.3%, and Pacific Islander 0.14%. Even if you add all three of these populations together to make one voting block that fights for one another’s interests (>6.9%), it makes up a very small minority in the United States and API Americans will continue to be marginalized. It’s better to come together and build coalitions for civil rights with all marginalized groups than to find divisions and continue to discriminate.
[...] all know how much Koreans hate gays so what could be worse than your son choosing the Liza Minnelli CD and turning into…one of [...]